It is whatever you buy a battery and charger for first. Then you are unwilling to forfeit that battery to just buy another tool. So you get another tool of the same brand, even if you aren’t happy with the previous. Then at that point, you’ve gone to far. You’ve got several hundred dollars in batteries you would have to give up just to switch. It is the most blatant example of the sunken cost fallacy.
Ryobi, specifically has entry level tools (a basic drill) that come with a charger and battery for cheaper than you can even buy a battery by itself. When you’re young and broke and all you need to do is hang some curtains or something you get it. But really, it is just a seed for your future “house” that you belong to.
I found a set of Makita tools for 60% off last year and now I’m Makita battery dependent for the rest of my life
In 10 years you will have thousands of dollars in makita tools because hey, that hammer drill you needed was only $110, better get another battery too, your old ones are getting tired. 🤷♂️ and you will always have makita tools, forever. Even if you hate them.
I used to be ride or die for Makita as an electrician, but they’ve gone downhill lately and their battery prices are insane! Used to be a Makita could fall off a ladder onto the chuck and bounce. Last year my crew had two drills newly bought that year CATCH FIRE and one strip the gearbox. Embarassing performance.
I’ve pivoted to Ridgid with their dirt cheap batteries with lifetime warranty. And I have a couple Ridgid->Makita adapters to use my new collection of Ridgid batteries with my tough old Makita tools. Battery adapters will free you from that lock-in.
Honestly I’ve been impressed with the Ridgid tools though, same manufacturer as Milwaukee and Ridgid has always been a big brand with plumbers. The brushless tools I’ve bought have been powerful and robust so far. No regrets
So TTI manufactures Milwaukee, Ryobi, and Ridgid power tools. I didn’t know they did Ridgid too. I wonder how many manufacturers there really are for the plethora of power tool brands. I’m gonna guess like three.
Wait TTI does dewalt too? I thought dewalt was same co as Milwaukee.
DeWalt is Stanley Black and Decker not tti
Feels like something the EU would eventually work on settling: making all tool manufacturers have a non-proprietary connector.
Just fucking make it all XT90 or something.
And have the battery dangling? XT90 also doesn’t provide any way to communicate things like max charging speed, cell voltage or failure conditions to the charger
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
https://piped.video/eKOvXigyrXA?si=XiTMEQfNU1XmF2LQ
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
I’m just waiting for the other shoe to drop and for a Belgian or something to drop in here to say that they’ve had fully interchangeable batteries for the last twenty years, and then make fun of us for building houses out of wood because we didn’t clear cut our continent.
More people should know there actually are adapters for different brands of batteries on amazon, and thingiverse if you have a 3D printer
And if you don’t have a 3D printer, your local library likely does.
Dewalt battery on a Dyson vacuum as well
A bunch of much better ones on Etsy too
Thanks for the tip :)
And if you don’t have a 3D printer, your local library likely does.
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Looking for this comment, I’m still running my craftsman 19.2 volt tools, but with a 20v DeWalt adapter, saved my from throwing away 1 reciprocating saw, 1 light, 1 1/4" impact, 2 drills, 1 90° drill, and a circular saw.
Yeah Ryobi is dirt cheap and good enough for most things. When you need to add another tool, choosing between the one that doesn’t have a battery and the one that does but is twice the price has a big influence on your decision.
Also, I’m not a contractor, so I only use certain tools once every six months. Have yet to have anything fail on me. If it does, maybe I’ll upgrade. Certain tools have already paid for themselves in that they saved me from needing to hire someone else. Just getting a pole saw and hedge trimmer alone saved me probably $700.
I do have a few of the other brands, but they were damn pricey and I don’t use them enough to justify it.
Fucking Ridgid got me, because on paper, they have lifetime warranties on their batteries. But after buying an expensive combo, they made it an absolute hassle to register my tools, so I kinda doubt they’ll honor their warranty. Now I’m Ridgid + Dewalt. My corded tools and hand tools are whatever brand; harbor freight or walmart if not used often, Milwaukee, DeWalt, etc if I expect to use them often.
I really dislike Home Depot after a series of huge customer service mishaps with me last year, and actively avoid going there now.
Which is a shame because I have a lot of Ryobi One tools. They are perfectly positioned for weekend warriors…huge tool library, good batteries, affordable and of fairly decent quality (certainly well above “junk” and a good value for the money).
Shame that is a store-exclusive brand.
The worst part is I’ve bought into most of the cordless tools I’d really need. The day might come where I want a larger circular saw (mines only 5.5 and it is prone to binding if your technique isn’t perfect, and even then…) or find that some of the tools that I’m okay with having corded (like a jigsaw or an angle grinder) I now need a cordless replacement. At that point I’ll likely find myself buying into a better and more expensive battery system and, for quite a while, only having the one seldom-used tool for it.
Now I’ve got a dead 4Ah battery and I’m on the fence as to rebuild it, buy a new one, or take it as an opportunity to start going into a new battery system.
It is whatever you buy a battery and charger for first. Then you are unwilling to forfeit that battery to just buy another too
One could go pneumatic, get a compressor and pneumatic tools.
That’s only good if you can bring your work to your garage.
I have a 100’ air hose that reaches anywhere in the house. I often run it outside and back in a window somewhere so it doesn’t end up in the way of family. I also have a small compressor for airbrushing rather than running permanent air lines from the garage to my basement workshop. You’ll still want cordless convenience for a drill and some other small tools though.
You can get portable compressors.
I’m not hauling my portable compressor into my attic, nor do I have an extension cord that can reach the end of my yard. It stays in my garage. Even then I prefer battery tools because of the noise when the compressor kicks on.
Milwaukee included a bag and floodlight in their drill package so I guess that did it for me. Most of my drill bits are Ryobi though.
(Not a dad, just a lesbian)
Would there be a way to 3D print plastic part of a battery and just fill it with standard battery types (cylindrical batteries) and make them swapable? Because as far as i know there isn’t really any electronics in batteries, just different voltages based on number of batteries in series and different mounting mechanism. It just seems like a silly vendor lock-in.
I actually did a lot of research on this when I bought my first battery tools, knowing this would be the case, and decided they had a decent range of everything I’d likely need.
I went with AEG.
Which is TTI, so the same as Milwaukee, Ryobi, and Rigid. I wonder if they are more of a non-US rebranded one of those 3
They’re identical to Ridgid, including the batteries being compatible.
This tracks.
DeWalt: high quality and good pedigree but overpriced = Slytherin
Milwaukee: basically the same as DeWalt, but less pretentious. Thinks they’re better and tougher though = Gryffindor
Makita: the smart choice for value, also best colors = Ravenclaw
Ryobi: I know it will break, but they’re just tools and I’m not serious about this anyway. I would rather spend more money on my family or other hobbies = Hufflepuff
Honorable mentions of other “houses” and schools in the thread.
Black and Decker/Craftsman/whatever. Used to be very impressive, but completely corrupted. Probably evil = Durmstrang (Russian school)
Festool: Beautiful, absolutely dripping with wealth signals. Still pretty amazing at what they do, but you might not want them on a job site = Beauxbatons (super wealthy French school)
Harbor freight: Simple, potentially the most powerful but also likely to break. Can probably accomplish what you need by using a wrench as a hammer, but you wouldn’t want to do anything delicate with it. Actually the biggest group of dad-wizards = Uagadou (the school in Uganda where magic was invented but they don’t use wands)
Festool is not on this list because Festool owners NEVER GET ANYONE PREGNANT.
Because you have to choose: children or Festool. Only the few elite can have both.
If I had enough money for Festool stuff I would probably just pay someone else to do the job instead!
Can confirm, had a vasectomy years ago.
Love the very, very few Festools that I have. But the price is painful.
Bosch
Specifically Bosch blue.
Interestingly I have a first generation Bosch Uneo (green consumer device, non changeable battery). Uneo is a consumer level cordless screwdriver and pneumatic hammer drill hybrid, it will easily put up to four to six holes into concrete walls (enough for home use when hanging something, but afterwards it’s empty and needs to be recharged)
The Uneo is one of my most useful tools for occasional use, and I know of no other brand which offers a similar tool which fulfills those roles in a non-craftsman home.
If you regularly build stuff its battery is too weak, but I use it a few times a year. Hang a picture, lamp or a wall cupboard in my apartment (which partly has concrete walls in this high-rise building) - not a problem.
Id like to get their compound miter with the hinge but probably won’t use it enough to justify the cost.
Metabo
You need to know that most power tools are ultimately owned by only a few brands
Milwaukee and Ryobi for example are both owned by TTI but the Marketing is strong.
https://www.protoolreviews.com/power-tool-manufacturers-who-owns-them/
Well, yes, but they serve drastically different markets, and the ownership structure is different. Ryobi is for the home owner that occasionally uses tools, and is licensed by a Japanese company to allow TTI to produce the brand. Milwaukee is for heavy daily use, and is wholly owned by TTI.
Its also worth mentioning that adapters are available to convert between battery systems. If you’re on Milwaukee and want to buy a DeWalt palm router (which is superior IMO) then you can just get a converter to use it with a Milwaukee battery. You can keep the converter in the tool itself, and most tools don’t mind this.
The exception is Ryobi. Converters only exist one-way, since Ryobi still uses “stick” type batteries for low voltage stuff. The opposite converter could theoretically exist (say, to use a Ryobi battery with a DeWalt router) but it would be very large and bulky and so nobody really makes them.
Ryobi batteries in general are very bulky. That 12 AH is like strapping a boot to your tools. It’s also seemingly their weak spot, as all I read is people complaining about their batteries.
They make a 12ah? I have the 4 and it’s huge. It lasts a surprisingly long time too. A 12ah would last a bazillion years.
Heck yeah! Makita is just Makita!
Japanese and over 100 years old…
House DeWalt: The Builders
House Ryobi: The Slapjobs
House Milwaukee: The wishes they were house DeWalt
House Makita: Quality prevails regardless of how little I use my tools.
Unmentioned:
House Bosch: House Makita but doesn’t like Asians
House Metabo: House Milwaukee but green
House Rigid: wow these are fuckin cheap
House Worx: Tools take a backseat to Yardwork
House Metabo HPT: My wife says they’re great
Milwaukee is better than DeWalt in literally every category. Come at me.
I was browsing the tool section at a Home Depot once a couple of years ago when a very attractive young woman came up to me and started asking me about my project. I’m not so dense that I thought she was hitting on me, but I couldn’t figure out her angle and I thought maybe she was a prostitute or something. Turns out she was a Milwaukee sales rep and she was trying to encourage people (men, rather) to buy some Milwaukee cordless tools.
So, technically not a prostitute.
Only if you go for the strict definition.
Any exchange of labour for money under an indentured system where you are under constant violent threat of homelessness, destitution, starvation, and even death if you don’t work, is a certain type of prostitution born of desperation.
TL;DR: most of us whose paycheques are signed by someone else are labour prostitutes.
This is today’s Lemmy Moment Of The Day.
I can’t say I disagree with any of that.
I’ve got AEG, which is basically yellow Milwaukee anyway.
I’ve used dewalt professionally for many years. My buddies who use Milwaukee are always borrowing my stuff. I’ll leave it at that.
Yeap, switched from Milwaukee from DeWalt recently. The tool quality is pretty much the same, but the Milwaukee battery and chargers are a lot nicer.
Except battery life in my experience.
My construction companion runs Milwaukee. As I stated in a different comment, he’s had several drills and batteries blow in about three years. This isn’t to say they’re not a great brand, but that’s too many lemons for the premium they charge for my taste. seems like their biggest downfall is the plastic shells they use, especially on batteries. Those little power check buttons break right quick, and the rubber over moulding doesn’t deal with grease well.
I run Metabo HPT, and I abuse the hell out of them. Drilling inch holes 12" deep in concrete for garage anchors, running all the batteries in sub zero and 100+ temps, notching studs until the multi tool is too hot to hold. Never had a failure in 6 years. Even my original batteries still work as well as the new. A slick bonus I found out being a compulsive tinkerer, the batteries that they sell as 18v 3ah are actually 24v 5ah. I always wondered why they lasted so long before I ripped a few apart. Samsung cells as well.
While I agree with you on most accounts, Milwaukee drills have cheap switches on them, they’re usually the first to hang to go. The chucks seem kinda cheap too, but honestly that’s not enough for me to switch teams, I’m married to Milwaukee, and the divorce would just be too damn expensive at this point.
House Hilti: Unyielding. Immutable. Eternal.
You forgot house Black & Decker
DeWalt is owned by Stanley Black&Decker
Rigid are mostly Milwaukee tools but cheaper.
Ngl, I absolutely love rigid. Most have lifetime guarantees, even on batteries.
Never had to exercise them fortunately.
Two different companies. Milwaukee and Ryobi are owned by the same company though.
Incorrect, Ridgid and AEG are also part of TTI.
Choice is an illusion.
The company also sells power tools, largely made by TTI,
Not as clever as you think you are.
House Bauer/Atlas/Hercules/Warrior: Life is transient, why does your tool or battery need to last longer than the job?
House Festool: Expensive, but I shift the cost to my clients.
Also, pretty systainers for storage and German ordnung.
House Harbor Freight: Safety squints aren’t enough danger
That’s not a house it’s a harbor
Nah Makita is trash, unless you’re talking LXT, which is 36 volt. Most of the Milwaukee stuff comes out on top on the torque test channel on YouTube.
But also don’t forget House Skil: Issue
You remember how Harry chose the house he wanted to be in, and it’s canon, that the sorting hat ward isn’t definite? When I was buying my first tool, I wanted a Ryobi. But they didn’t have it in stock and they did have Makita on sale and the sales guy told me that would be much better for the same price. So after that I’m buying only Makita, to fit the rest.
I dropped my locking, variable speed, single direction, corded drill with the chuck key electrical taped to the cracked plastic cord on a board and the hole I needed formed naturally out of fear.
Quality-wise, Makita > DeWALT ≥ Milwaukee > Ryobi, at least, if you watch teardowns by guys like AvE.
Power tools are like cars; companies hold several brands and target them to different market segments, like Porsche and VW.
Ryobi is owned by the same company as Milwauki; it’s the budget line, Milwauki being their premium line.
DeWALT and Black & Decker are owned by the same company; DeWALT is their premium line.
The exception in this list is Makita, which is its own company. They’re also objectively more well-built than the others (here), and correspondingly usually more expensive.
The premium lines are better quality (not just more expensive) but also tend to have smaller battery-tool options. Despite being a budget line, I mostly own B&D because most of my tools these days are 24V and there are more tool options there. The few, select, DeWALT tools I have are noticably better quality.
I don’t use power tools enough to justify Makita, but also, their battery-powered line is comparatively tiny. As someone else said, there’s a lot of motivation to pick a (compatible) lane, whichever it is. For most home-gamers, the quality difference will probably not matter much. If I were made of money, though, I’d have everything Makita except for the things they don’t make.
I’m in that fifth house that no-one ever seems to talk about: BOSCH.
J/K, I’m mostly Bosch, but I look towards whichever manufacturer makes the best version of a tool I currently need. For example, my chainsaws and yard/orchard power tools are Stihl, my lawnmower is Husqvarna, my circular saw, worm drive saw and abrasion/steel cutoff saw are all Skilsaw (not Skil!), and my oscillating multi tool is Fein.
Plus, many of the domestics are vintage, from before production was outsourced out of America, which makes them much more reliable and robust than modern tools. Even some of the other tools are vintage – my Stihl 076 Super can cut through a 60cm log like a hot knife through butter. And I have both 36″ and 72″ bars to go with it.
I always lean towards Bosch where possible, mainly because of their charitable work. The founder set things up so that it’s perpetually funded from the company profits. That just appeals to me as the tiebreaker when deciding between a bunch of similarly priced tools that will otherwise do the job well enough.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Bosch_Stiftung
That said, I tend to go for corded options where practical. I have some corded tools that I’ve owned for over thirty years now that still get occasional use. Battery tools are convenient for their portability, but they do have a limit to their useful life.
But when it comes to battery power tools, you have to pick a brand and stick with it, unless you’re John D Rockefeller with 6 types of charger and a billion battery packs.
Even within a brand, you usually contend with at least two different battery packs - 12v and higher - and even more if you keep your tools in good condition and their connection types are obsoleted before you buy more tools.
That would put me in the Sixth House (seems like we’ve jumped ship from the Potterverse to the Locked Tomb series now?) as a Metabo HPT user – at least for battery-operated tools. I’ve got no allegiances when it comes to corded power tools, though – got everything from Harbor Freight only-need-it-for-one-job specials to DeWalt saws and routers, and a big ol’ Craftsman drill press I inherited from my grandfather.
Corded can be great! I have corded Bosch for anything in my workshop - why would I need batteries for a location with dozens of sockets? - and use batteries mainly in the field or where cords would start to get impractical. Plus, where the manufacturer only makes a battery version of the tool. The Bosch PROFACTOR GDS18V-740N, for example, only comes in a battery version. No corded version exists.
20v to house DeWalt!
Couple years back I went to the graduation party of a kid my step daughter was friends. The dad had an entire wall pegboarded out with every possible Ryobi cordless tool. It was honestly impressive. And he had one Makita tool. Made me laugh.
Of course, real recognises real
Straight up Ryobi here. It’s not pro-hardcore, but for homeowner DIY and the variety and range of devices, it’s been solid.
Pretty funny how Home Depot has stayed neutral and carried all those brands.
Im a ryobi slut too, mainly for the price, except for a few old Metabo grinders which are built like brick shithouses and will probably outlive me.
Metabo for the win!!! I’ve got a metabo pneumatic brad nailer and it’s high quality, light, and affordable AF.
I’ve found that any project my Ryobi isn’t suited for is a project I would have opted to hire a professional anyway. 99% of people can get away with Ryobi 99% of the time. That remaining 1% really isn’t worth the increased price from brands like Dewalt.
Maybe I am a gorilla but every time I buy Ryobi - it breaks before the first job is done.
I got a Ryobi pressure washer and not even 2 hours into washing - it exploded like a fuckin bomb. Home Depot gave me a refund for the pressure washer but not my pants.
Jesus thats got to be a defect on a scale that impacts an entire run or something. Do they use cintered aluminum in their pump housings or something?!
Same… it’s hard to justify getting the most expensive tools when I only use them once every 3-6 months. If other people want to spend their money keeping up with tool brands that’s a competition I’ll gladly lose. Got better things to spend my money on.
They are fine for anything which doesn’t require precision. I have a Ryobi bench sander and it’s a complete waste of time. Same with the chop saw I unused to have. It was basically impossible to get flush miters from it no matter how much you adjusted it - the tolerances were just too low. My DeWalt table saw and Chop saw don’t have the same issues. They cut sub-mm precision on day one and still do years later. The table saw in particular is technically a worksite saw, buy you can use it to build cabinets with the right blade.
This was me, with my few random ryobi tools, until I needed something new and saw one of those big combos of several tools from DeWalt was half price. So I lucked out being in the right place at the right time and got the best of both worlds.
In case you are not aware you can get Adapters for one battery system to another. They make Ryobi to DeWalt and then back again.
Obviously don’t use them with the chargers.
Good to know, thanks!
Fortunately I already have like 4 DeWalt batteries. Somebody gave me a couple as a gift some time after I got the tool set. We definitely still have a Ryobi battery or two around as well!
On top of Ryobi tools, when my Dyson cordless vac battery stopped holding a charge, I bought a Ryobi -> Dyson adapter, and now my Dyson vacuum also uses Ryobi batteries. Wife was really impressed with it because you can just swap out a new battery and keep on vacuuming. Also the vacuum actually make use of that battery way more than any of the actual power tools I have.
Not a dad but heavily into the Makita gang. As a German I should be into Hilti or Metabo but Makita just hits the sweetspot of quality and pricing for me.
Same here brother, Makita all the way. I respect all the brands, but once you buy a battery and a charger for one brand, you’re in it.
You forgot Bosch! It’s a shit company in my opinion though… they also produce in Chinese prison camps
Yeah, no. Same reason. Garbage chinesium.
Not really selling it well
Only issue with Makita is s their battery tech hasnt caught up with everyone else. They seem to have forgotten their 18 volt line in favor of their 36 volt.
Project Farm on YouTube has great tests and reviews of products like this. Fully recommend his channel if you are in the market to buy tools or tool adjacent products.
Fuck yeah. Project Farm rules! He’s like Bob Ross for me. I just chill and watch tool-science happen.
Torque test channel is pretty much completely power tool specific and goes a lot more in depth on them. PF for breadth, TTC for depth.
